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This page (revision-20) was last changed on 11-Dec-2006 22:42 by RadomirDopieralski  

This page was created on 04-Oct-2006 16:23 by RadomirDopieralski

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At line 1 added 9 lines
* IMHO, there should be a history of the rationale for each decision (pros and cons). This would avoid many repetitive discussions.
* As wiki syntax is going to be for the technically inclinded in the long run (with WYSIWYG editors becoming more popular for wikis all the time), I wonder why linebreaks are now the default, as opposed to explicit line breaks like in HTML and LaTeX. For my next wiki, I want to mix LaTeX and Creole so (in my case) this convention is quite unfortunate.
* One thing that I think transcends taste (like, admittedly, in the last item) is "//" for italics. Why make parsing even more complicated and have italics clash with URIs? Why not use double tilde "{{{ ~~ }}}" (squiggly lines are used for marking up italics in handwriting)? What about https: and mailto: URIs? At the very least, "://" should be exempt from being interpreted as italics (and not just "http://" and "ftp://".
* Could you further explain what the place holder {{{ {[x]} }}} is about?
Thanks for the good work, it is really good to have a standard such as Creole.
-- [AxelRauschmayer], 2006-10-21
At line 17 added 82 lines
!Creole 0.2 violates [Goals]
In particular:
# Using {{{ {{..}} }}} for pre is not collision free - {{{ {{..}} }}} is used by MediaWiki for templates. This is a huge collision - it would prevent Creole co-existing with MediaWiki, probably the most popular wiki of them all. (Being collsion free is the number one goal.)
# Using {{{<<..>>}}} for images. This violates goal 4, Not New. According to [wikimatrix|http://www.wikimatrix.org/syntax.php?i=116] __no__ wiki uses {{{<<..>>}}} for images.
# Using {{{<<..>>}}} for images is not collision free - it collides with TiddlyWiki's use of {{{<<..>>}}} for macros.
-- [MartinBudden], 2006-10-08
I see that some changes have been reverted, and so the previous comments should be considered resolved. But I've noticed that the syntax for placeholders is still different form previous version:
{{{ {[x]} }}}
Is it intended, or simply forgotten?
Apart from this, I would like to see quotations and simple tables included into Creole 0.2. From my point of view, they would make Creole much more useful. I see there's some discussion about tables, but nothing about quotations... This is quite surprising!
I think the chosen goals are reasonable and important, and the proposed syntax is quite good for satisfying them. But probably now having some **use cases** would help a lot.
-- MicheleTomaiuolo
Changing the placeholder syntax back to Creole 0.1 was just forgotten. Sorry about that.
I read: "Any markup within a link will not be parsed".
Is it necessary to specify this? I would say this is in contrast with the ExtensibleByOmission goal. Moreover in [Images] there are examples of images inside links, which is a special case of markup inside links. Thanks.
-- 2006-11-06, MicheleTomaiuolo
Please give a bit more notice before declaring something final. On Nov 9 you stated that Creole 0.2 would be declared final on Nov 11. Two day's notice is hardly enough: it's only sufficient for people who read the site every day, and even for them it assumes they have time to comment on any given day.
-- [MartinBudden], 2006-11-13
Well, it was just a minor change, but you are right. We should agree on a [ReleasePolicy], but right now i don't have a clue how it could look like. Maybe you could post links to other release policies so that we could learn from them.
-- [ChristophSauer], 2006-11-14
Martin, when would you suggest be the final date before declaring Creole 0.2 final? It really is only a very minor change and has been on the site for a month now for comment.
--[ChuckSmith], 2006-11-14
I'm not asking for you to not declare Creole 0.2 final (after all, you are still accepting comments on 0.3), merely that in future you give more notice. I suggest 2 week's notice for a 0.x release and (at least) a month's notice before you declare Creole 1.0 final.
-- [MartinBudden], 2006-11-16
I found an error in the section "Bold, Italics, Links, Pre in Lists". The last list item in the Creole example contains preformatted markup which should render to {{{<tt>}}} in the recommended XHTML output but does not.
-- [OliverHorn], 2006-11-23
Thanks! I just corrected it.
-- [ChuckSmith], 2006-11-23
I was wondering if there could be wiki creole syntax for underlining and striking text ? These can be very convenient to emphasize something in a text. I often see stroke text as a way to express some sort of "slip of the tongue". So, here is my suggestion, which feels quite straightforward to me, at least :
* underscore as {{{__my underscore text__}}}
* strike as {{{--my stroke text--}}}
If there is a discussion somewhere on this website about "why creole shouldn't have strike and underscore", sorry for the disturbance for I didn't find it.
-- [ThomasGirod], 2006-11-28
Thanks for your suggestion. We are in the process of gathering information and forming kind of GoodPractices for creating a wiki markup -- please add anything you find useful to this link language.
I'm not sure about everyday usefulness of a "subscript" markup, outside some very specific areas of science, which beg for their own markup extensions anyways.
As for strikeout markup, I'm of two minds. On the one hand, I often use those "^H" myself, as a kind of rhetoric figure or pun (by the way, why not use it as the markup? ;) ), on the other hand, it's really very rare -- remember that every feature added to WikiCreole makes it a little harder both to implement and inculcate for wiki developers and admins, and to learn for wiki users. Does it really give you such a great boos in expressiveness to justify that?
A separate issue is the choice of markup -- especially the possible conflicts with dashes and/or signature marks. But that's a minor problem, if we decide to include the "deleted" text, we can surely come up with markup for it.
The main question is: "Do we need it?"
-- [[RadomirDopieralski]], 2006-12-11
Version Date Modified Size Author Changes ... Change note
20 11-Dec-2006 22:42 6.488 kB RadomirDopieralski to previous corrected a misunderstanding
19 11-Dec-2006 22:39 6.931 kB RadomirDopieralski to previous | to last
18 28-Nov-2006 13:03 5.346 kB to previous | to last
17 28-Nov-2006 13:01 5.35 kB to previous | to last what about underscore and strike ?
16 23-Nov-2006 14:05 4.748 kB ChuckSmith to previous | to last
15 23-Nov-2006 11:59 4.684 kB OliverHorn to previous | to last
14 16-Nov-2006 07:07 4.411 kB to previous | to last
13 14-Nov-2006 12:00 4.109 kB ChuckSmith to previous | to last what date would be good for you?
12 14-Nov-2006 07:06 3.899 kB Christoph to previous | to last respon to martin about release
11 13-Nov-2006 01:29 3.625 kB MartinBudden to previous | to last
10 05-Nov-2006 14:32 3.285 kB MicheleTomaiuolo to previous | to last markup within a link
9 23-Oct-2006 13:23 2.968 kB ChuckSmith to previous | to last
8 21-Oct-2006 18:23 2.859 kB null to previous | to last
7 21-Oct-2006 18:22 2.857 kB to previous | to last
6 21-Oct-2006 18:21 2.853 kB to previous | to last
5 21-Oct-2006 18:18 2.838 kB to previous | to last
4 17-Oct-2006 16:37 1.75 kB MicheleTomaiuolo to previous | to last
3 08-Oct-2006 11:41 1.032 kB MartinBudden to previous | to last
2 04-Oct-2006 22:11 0.375 kB Andreas Gohr to previous | to last
1 04-Oct-2006 16:23 0.076 kB RadomirDopieralski to last alt?
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